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<groggy> sfr!
<sfr> groggy: get grub sorted out?
<groggy> sfr: No.
<sfr> strange
<groggy> sfr: Take a look at http://www.lemis.com/grog/diary.html and tell me what I'm doing wrong.
<groggy> sfr: It panics trying to mount the root file system.
<sfr> I am not sure I would know.
<groggy> sfr: But the specs are the same as for the 2.4 kernel, which boots fine.
<sfr> I was inspired to change from lilo to grub yesterday and it just worked ...
* groggy wonders if there's code in Debian to detect BSD hackers.
<sfr> groggy: but there is Debian/BSD ...
<groggy> sfr: Are you taking me seriously again?
<sfr> never! :-)
<sfr> groggy: what does " [Format recovered--see http://www.lemis.com/email/email-format.html]" at the top of your diary page mean?
<groggy> sfr: Means I've stuffed up my diary :-(
* groggy recovers his diary format.
<groggy> sfr: OK, fixed.
<sfr> :-)
<groggy> sfr: dkaiser thinks that the problem mounting root might be related to devfs.  What do you think?
<groggy> sfr: I built the kernel with the standard parameters; make oldconfig; make.
<sfr> from a bare kernel tree, "make oldconfig" gives you a default config, not an all encompassing one
<sfr> it use to be Linus' config, but he mainly uses his g5 these days ...
<groggy> Yes, exactly what I was looking for.
<groggy> So it shouldn't do anything funny.
<groggy> I'm really puzzled by why this is so difficult.
<dkaiser> groggy: did you try the devfs=nomount argument for the kernel boot?
<dkaiser> also.  since you can't boot the stock 2.4 kernel that came with the distribution, i don't really think devfs is an issue at this moment
<groggy> dkaiser: No, still wondering whether that would be the case.  You see what I was saying to sfr?
<groggy> dkaiser: And I was wrong: I can boot the 2.4 kernel.
<dkaiser> oh, ok
<groggy> http://www.lemis.com/grog/diary.html
<dkaiser> i hadn't read the url yet
<dkaiser> VFS: Cannot open root device "hda1" or unknown-block(0,0)
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<dkaiser> groggy: what is listed as the root in menu.lst?
<groggy> dkaiser: Not sure what you're referring to.
<dkaiser> oh, it's in the diary, nevermind.
<dkaiser> kernel      /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.12.3 root=/dev/hda1 ro 
<dkaiser> groggy: well, if 2.4 boots, you'd best figure out why 2.6 cannot find /dev/hda1
<dkaiser> i may think again that devfs is built-in and enabled by default
<sfr> groggy: what is your disk controller?
<sfr> dkaiser: I hope it isn't on 2.6 ...
<sfr> devfs has been deprecated on 2.6 ...
* groggy digs through unfamiliar dmesg output.
<groggy> What should I be looking for?
<groggy> devfs: v1.12c (20020818) Richard Gooch (rgooch@atnf.csiro.au)
<groggy> devfs: boot_options: 0x0
<groggy> That's 2.4.
<groggy> NFORCE2: IDE controller at PCI slot 00:09.0
<groggy> NFORCE2: chipset revision 162
<groggy> NFORCE2: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
<groggy> NFORCE2: BIOS didn't set cable bits correctly. Enabling workaround.
<groggy> NFORCE2: BIOS didn't set cable bits correctly. Enabling workaround.
<groggy> ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with idebus=xx
<groggy> NFORCE2: 00:09.0 (rev a2) UDMA133 controller
<groggy>     ide0: BM-DMA at 0xf000-0xf007, BIOS settings: hda:DMA, hdb:DMA
<groggy>     ide1: BM-DMA at 0xf008-0xf00f, BIOS settings: hdc:DMA, hdd:DMA
<groggy> hda: WDC WD2000JB-00GVC0, ATA DISK drive
<groggy> blk: queue f8829720, I/O limit 4095Mb (mask 0xffffffff)
<groggy> hdc: PIONEER DVD-RW DVR-108, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
<groggy> ide0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14
<groggy> ide1 at 0x170-0x177,0x376 on irq 15
<groggy> hda: attached ide-disk driver.
<groggy> hda: 390721968 sectors (200050 MB) w/8192KiB Cache, CHS=24321/255/63, UDMA(100)
<sfr> so did you get anything similar when you booted the 2.6 kernel i.e. I wonder if that driver is in your 2.6 kernel at all ...
<sfr> (the NFORCE2 bit, I mean)
<dkaiser> ah...  /me thinks sfr is onto something here
<groggy> Well, it got quite a way through the boot.
<groggy> I'll go and check.
<sfr> thanks
<groggy> But wouldn't it make more sense to check the kernel config file first?
<sfr> also you should install module-ini-tools and udev before you boot 2.6 ...
<groggy> # CONFIG_I2C_NFORCE2 is not set
<groggy> But that's I2C.
<sfr> if you can, yes, check the config
<sfr> right
<groggy> And the only mention of NFORCE2.
<groggy> Nothing in the section # IDE chipset support/bugfixes reaches out and grabs me.
<sfr> groggy: is this x86_64?
<groggy> No, Athlon XP+.
<groggy> Normal ia32.
<dwg> groggy: I have a config, but it's for x86_64
<groggy> I deliberately avoided amd64 for this sort of reason :-)
<groggy> === root@deeveear (/dev/pts/1) /usr/src/linux/linux-2.6.12.3 4 -> make xconfig
<groggy> *
<groggy> * Unable to find the QT installation. Please make sure that the
<groggy> * QT development package is correctly installed and the QTDIR
<groggy> *sigh*
<sfr> try make menuconfig ..
<groggy> === root@deeveear (/dev/pts/1) /usr/src/linux/linux-2.6.12.3 5 -> make menuconfig
<groggy> >> You must install ncurses-devel in order
<groggy> >> to use 'make menuconfig'
<sfr> apt-get install ncurses-devel
<groggy> Why is there *nothing* of use in these 2 GB of installed stuff/
<groggy> Just GNOME and other useless stuff.
<mpe> make gconfig
<sfr> good luck :-)
<groggy> * Unable to find the GTK+ installation. Please make sure that
<groggy> * the GTK+ 2.0 development package is correctly installed...
<groggy> * You need gtk+-2.0, glib-2.0 and libglade-2.0.
* bje hands groggy a FreeBSD CD
<groggy> bje: Thanks.
<sfr> bje: you are on holidays - no enjoying yourself :-)
<Rasmus> why do you need a graphical config anyway?
<dwg> groggy: want a copy of my config?
<groggy> === root@deeveear (/dev/pts/1) /usr/src/linux/linux-2.6.12.3 9 -> apt-get  install ncurses-devel
<groggy> Reading Package Lists... Done
<groggy> Building Dependency Tree... Done
<groggy> E: Couldn't find package ncurses-devel
<groggy> Rasmus: Because I hate hitting "Return" so often.
<Rasmus> just edit the file
<sfr> and then run make oldconfig, or bad things will happen ...
<groggy> Rasmus: There's nothing to edit.
<dwg> groggy: what was sfr thinking.  libncurses5-dev is the one you need
<Rasmus> delete the lines you want to re-visit and then run "make oldconfig" again
<sfr> dwg: thanks
<Rasmus> You don't have a .config?
<mpe> groggy, CONFIG_BLK_DEV_AMD74XX=y ?
<groggy> mpe: Thanks.  But that wasn't sfr's fault, that was the error message telling me to install the wrong name.
<groggy> CONFIG_BLK_DEV_AMD74XX=m
<setuid> tee hee
<groggy> mpe: How did you choose that particular entry?
<groggy> Media Change: Please insert the disc labelled
<groggy>  'Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 r0a _Sarge_ - Official i386 Binary-1 (20050607)'
<groggy> in the drive '/cdrom/' and press enter
<groggy> Grrr!
<groggy> It's in there!
<mpe> cause the help say it provides support for the nvidia nforce2
<Rasmus> so you do have a .config you can edit
<groggy> mpe: Ah.  That's why I was looking for the menu-based config.
<setuid> or zcat /proc/config.gz
<setuid> Assuming your kernel has kconfig support
<groggy> So why do I have to mount the DVD manually before I can install anything?
<setuid> You don't
<groggy> setuid: I do.
<setuid> Then you broke something ;) 
<dwg> groggy: just sent a config file
<groggy> setuid: I installed Debian.
<setuid> Linux version 2.6.12.3 (root@angst) (gcc version 4.0.1 (Debian 4.0.1-2)) #3 Tue Jul 19 16:56:57 EDT 2005
<groggy> I downloaded the kernel from kernel.org.
<mpe> groggy, you can just grep in drivers/ide/Kconfig
<groggy> Ran make oldconfig, make config, make install.
<setuid> I've never built a kernel like that
<groggy> mpe: Anyway, there's a module there.  Won't it load it on demand?
<groggy> setuid: I have.
<groggy> setuid: And it's what sfr recommended.
* groggy wonders why everybody has a different way to build and install a kernel.
<setuid> How does it back up your old kernel and re-edit menu.lst? 
<setuid> Which kernel does it make the default? 
<setuid> Where does it put System.map? 
<groggy> setuid: Read http://www.lemis.com/grog/diary.html.
<groggy> setuid: This is the third day of trying just to *install* the bloody system.
<setuid> I've installed Debian at least 50 times this year alone
<Rasmus> Millions of kids around the world has managed to figure it out
<setuid> And I've never had trouble, except when I burned the cd/dvd incorrectloy
<mpe> groggy, make && sudo make modules_install && sudo make install && sudo update-grub
<groggy> dwg: Thanks.
<groggy> Rasmus: Maybe you need to be a kid.
<Rasmus> perhaps
<groggy> Seriously, I've never had anything like this much trouble before.  So:
* setuid notes that Debian works fine
<setuid> So you're doing something non-standard
<groggy> How many of you have installed Debian Sarge from the DVD?
* sfr remembers that his recommendation was tongue-in-cheek ...
<sfr> groggy: we all install using rsync :-)
<Rasmus> I usually just download a boot image and do a network install
<groggy> sfr: FWIW, I really have done this several times before.
<sfr> groggy: I know - after all you are older than I am :-)
*** Signoff: setuid (Quit: other job)
<groggy> OK, if I use aptitude to install packages, how do I find the 2.6 kernel?
<groggy> base?
<groggy> Yup.
<groggy> OK, installing a kernel from the DVD.
* Rasmus wonders what the heck aptitude is
<groggy> aptitude is some reverse video interface to apt*.
<sfr> Rasmus: dselect with attitude :-)
* groggy squints at the illegible display.
<groggy> sfr: Should I be using dselect instead?
<sfr> groggy: my son thinks syanptic is OK
<Rasmus> apt-cache search kernel-image-2.6
<sfr> groggy: I would not remmoend that to anyone - but I use it ...
<sfr> s/remmoend/recommend/ (or some such spelling :-))
<groggy> Rasmus: I've found it.  But I still need to decide what the difference is between kernel-image-2.6-k7 and  kernel-image-2.6.8.11-k7
<sfr> kernel-image-2.6-k7 is probably a "wrapper" package that probably depends on kernel-image-2.6.8.11-k7
<sfr> hmmm, Depends: kernel-image-2.6.8-2-k7
<groggy> Grr.  I can't mark the text.
<sfr> in Debian unstable ...
<groggy> Why does it tell me to install kernel-package and then not offer it?
<sfr> " This package will always depend on the latest 2.6 kernel image available
<sfr>  for AMD Duron/Athlon."
* mpe thinks we should all chip in to buy groggy a free ubuntu cd
<groggy> mpe: I have one.
<sfr> not for a server surely ...
<groggy> chris suggested that I install Debian, not Ubuntu.
<groggy> Anyway, this should work.
<sfr> groggy: which text can't you mark?
<groggy> The best I can guess is that the Sarge installation process is broken.
<groggy> sfr: Anything in aptitude.
<sfr> ahhh
<groggy> sfr: It's an ncurses app, it seems, but it's grabbed the mouse.
<groggy> Grrr.
<groggy> Now  I have the DVD in the drive, it's mounted on the correct mount point, and it keeps reprompting me to install it.
<sfr> groggy: unmount it ? :-)
<groggy> Ah, no, it did so last time.
<groggy> Why do I have to mount it manually?
<sfr> groggy: we don't know
<groggy> You already have a LILO configuration in /etc/lilo.conf
<groggy> Install a boot block using the existing /etc/lilo.conf? [Yes] 
<groggy> *sigh*
<groggy> I'm booting with GRUB.
* sfr wonders if he will hear back from theplanet.com after reporting one of their users trying to break into ozlabs.org ...
<groggy> sfr: Unlikely.
<groggy> sfr: How were they trying to do it?
<groggy> And of course it hasn't updated the grub files :-(
<sfr> one of the ssh password guessing scripts ...
<groggy> sfr: Yes, I'm getting them all the time.
<groggy> We should write  a script that firewalls IP addresses after n attempts
<sfr> so do we, these irritated me though because there revers DNS gives bad names so I got thousands of entries in the logs ...
<sfr> groggy: I think there is a netilter module that does just that ,,,
<groggy> OK, how do I tell grub to update its bootstrap?
<sfr> s/til/tfil/
<sfr> ?
<groggy> I've installed a new kernel.
<groggy> grub doesn't know about it.
<sfr> update-grub
<groggy> Thanks.
<sfr> yoo know that from the grub prompt (when booting), you can boot any file you can fine ...
<sfr> s/fine/find/
* groggy wonders why his box still thinks it's in localhost.localdomain after it knows bloody well it's in lemis.com.
<groggy> ... as long as you know the incantation.
<groggy> Good to know, though.
<sfr> groggy: of course :-)
<groggy> OK, let's try to boot the new kernel.
* groggy crosses his fingers.
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<sfr> groggy: at some point you probably should remove lilo
<sfr> the kernel install scripts may be confused by the fact that you have both lilo and grub installed
<sfr> I don't know, sorry - I will have a look
<sfr> keith is pretty sure we don't ...
<groggy> Grrr!
<groggy> It's gone and overwritten my GRUB bootstrap without asking me.
<sfr> <groggy> You already have a LILO configuration in /etc/lilo.conf
<sfr> <groggy> Install a boot block using the existing /etc/lilo.conf? [Yes] 
<sfr> did you answer no?
<groggy> sfr: Sure, but it was lying.
<groggy> sfr: Ah, OK.
<sfr> nto if you have /etc/lilo.conf
<sfr> did it boot>
<sfr> ?
<groggy> Yes, but it didn't give me a choice of kernel.
<sfr> but did it boot your new kernel?
* groggy has spent 3 days trying to do something that shouldn't even require manual intervention.
<groggy> sfr: It booted the kernel I just installed.  2.6.8.
<groggy> I have a 2.6.11 kernel there, and I have no idea how to boot it.
<sfr> well? :-)
<sfr> ahh
<groggy> Because the 'make install foomagic' incantations don't seem to work.
<sfr> what does /vmlinuz point at>
<sfr> ?
<groggy> The new kernel.
<sfr> oh
<sfr> you mean 2.6.8 or 2.6.11?
<groggy> 2.6.
<groggy> OK, I'll read the LILO man page and see if I can get something going there.
<groggy> So what kernel make target updates these symlinks?
<sfr> maybe make install
<sfr> which should run /sbin/installkernel
<groggy> OK, running.
<groggy> GRUB is installed. To automatically switch to new kernels, point your
<groggy> default entry in menu.lst to /boot/arch/i386/boot/bzImage-2.6.12.3
<groggy> *sigh*
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<sfr> :-)
<groggy> No change to the symlink.
<sfr> grub doesn't use the symlinks
<groggy> But can't I just change lilo.conf?
<groggy> One point to grub.
<sfr> yes you can
<groggy> The thing is, the message is wrong.  At the moment I have LILO again.
<sfr> but that is hard to guess if you have both installed
<groggy> After I spent 90 minutes installing GRUB, working around the floppy breakage.
<sfr> you would have to find the boot block signature ...
<groggy> So it shouldn't try to guess.
<sfr> so, why did you move from lilo?
<groggy> dkaiser recommended to do so.
<sfr> aahhh, I would as well - if it will work for you ...
* groggy decides that grub is a can of worms.
<sfr> it has advantages
<sfr> not a can fo grubs :-)
<hughhalf> groggy: Yes, I stuck with Lilo myself for similar reasons
<groggy> hughhalf: Thanks for the info.
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<hughhalf> groggy: I'm afraid it was one of these things where I could see it was more flexible, but I just needed something simple to boot my kernel with :)
<tpot> ah bsd - 14 lines of copyright notices when logging in to a HPUX box
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<groggy> tpot: BSD?
<dwg> groggy: I found grub was a bitch to install, though it's been trouble free thereafter.
<tpot> ok, BSD licenced code then
<groggy> dwg: I only got to the first stage.
<dwg> groggy: these days I just make sure I have a backup copy of the whole mbr - if something clobbers grub, I just dd that back.
<sfr> hughhalf: OK
<hughhalf> Thanks
<groggy> tpot: Right, lawyers.
<groggy> dwg: Been there, done that.  But you still need to get the machine up and stumbling.